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*** THE ALIYAH REVOLUTION ALBUM ***

Thursday, July 12, 2007

The case for Baseball in Israel



Recently Yishai presented seven reasons why baseball is essentially evil and why bringing it to Israel will harm the Jewish nation. Of course these reasons are all nothing more than pure nonsense. (If I'm being unnecessarily harsh it's to match the tone of the original article.)

Read on!


Yishai claims baseball will make Israelis get fat because they will only watch baseball and not play it. His proof is that "America is a country of overweight watchers, not healthy players." What Yishai is forgetting is that this is Israel and not America. Do Israelis watch soccer and not play it? Do Israelis watch basketball and not play it? Of course they play them! There are games going on 24 hours a day in Gan Saker. The culture of Israel is to be active and introducing another sport will only encourage more activity. The IBL started a baseball camp this summer with hundreds of Israeli kids learning the ins and outs of baseball.

The second ridiculous reason offered is that the players will get paid millions while the teachers get paid pennies. Once again I remind our readers we are talking about Israel and not America. Yossi Benayoun was Israelis highest paid player... I say was because, well, he wasn't making millions of dollars here and he wanted millions of dollars. To get it he had to leave Israel. Israel does that. She spits out just about anyone that wants only money. Israeli baseball players could never make anywhere near the money Major League players like A-Rod get simply because the teams would never be able to earn enough money. Today IBL players make a measly $1000 each - for the entire season.

Vayikra 18:3 - "Bechukoteyehem Lo Teleichu" is the third reason that baseball is evil. Yishai claims that when Rashi writes "their stadiums" and "their theaters" he means sports not just Roman-fighting. But there is no basis for that claim and no source was cited to support it. Indeed the Romans were not known to have any non-violent public sports at all. There may be some modern day poskim that posken this way (though I am not aware of any) however I do know that Kehillat Ohr Shalom in RBS has arranged a group trip to a Blue Sox game where the Rabbi, Rav Chaim Soloveitchik, shlita, has been invited to throw out the first ball. Seems at least he doesn't learn Rashi the way Yishai does.

Reason number four was an interesting one that was similar to number three. Namely that Baseball is not a "Jewish thing" because there are no rabbinic sources "lauding going to or watching professional sports." Well guess what? There are no rabbinic sources "lauding" listening to a radio show either! Or reading a web blog! Just because the gentiles do something doesn't inherently make it something evil. As for a rabbinic source see my response to number three. At least one Rabbi is bringing his congregation to a game.

Yishai fifth was that 60% of the players are goyim. I say so what? Just because they are goyim they are evil? I for one don't subscribe to that notion. There are very many good goyim in the world and the Torah even allows for goyim under the right circumstances to live in Israel - which by the way - none of the non-Jewish players are doing. That said the IBL has declared on the record their intention to have majority of the players be native Israelis. That's one of the reasons for the baseball summer camps - to get Israeli youngsters playing baseball so Israelis can enjoy watching the local talent.

The sixth reason Yishai gave is imbecilic. No, really! Baseball is bittul Torah? By that logic so is listening to the radio and eating. Forget sleeping! Yes, Yishai you were right when you wrote "we all need relaxation and entertainment" and an outing at a baseball game is just that - relaxation and entertainment in a nice clean kosher family atmosphere. Many - actually most - of the games actually coincide with all Yeshiva Gedolah's bein hazmanim. Ask any Rosh Yeshiva. It is a mitzvah to take a break from a rigid Torah learning schedule to help one feel refreshed and learn better when the new zman commences. That's why every Yeshiva in the world has a bein hazmanim. I could think of a lot worse ways bochrim could spend their bein hazmanim.

I didn't quite understand the seventh and final reason that baseball in Israel is evil. It was that since sports could be followed on cable television and on the Internet, "why bring this thing to Israel?" This I don’t get! Going out to a baseball game with the family is evil but bringing into the home the disgusting images that are featured on cable television, not to mention the Internet, are not a problem? Baseball is evil but the Internet is not? Sorry Yishai, but that is a very fat pitch!

We should be very thankful that the IBL has arrived in this young nation and we should give it our blessing and wish it much success. It will hopefully help the economy here and will make life in Israel more enjoyable for Israelis and for thousands of Olim that dreaded never again being able to ask Dad to take them out to the ballgame!








9 Comments:

  • At 5:28 PM , Blogger Ezra said...

    Back! Back! To the warning track...

    And it's gone!!

    Pinchas takes The Yish down to Chinatown!

     
  • At 8:07 PM , Blogger Levi said...

    all i can say is: this is just one more notch. The assimilation of a nation is happening before our very eyes and we don't just stand idly by but we applaud as well. so, we are currently watching baseball and preparing ourselves for a Sunday sabbath which has the backing of the NRP... where is the apple pie to complete the transition??

     
  • At 8:14 PM , Blogger Yishai said...

    1. Pinchas writes: Yishai claims baseball will make Israelis get fat because they will only watch baseball and not play it. His proof is that "America is a country of overweight watchers, not healthy players." What Yishai is forgetting is that this is Israel and not America. Do Israelis watch soccer and not play it? Do Israelis watch basketball and not play it? Of course they play them! There are games going on 24 hours a day in Gan Saker. The culture of Israel is to be active and introducing another sport will only encourage more activity. The IBL started a baseball camp this summer with hundreds of Israeli kids learning the ins and outs of baseball.

    Yishai: Israeli teachers, parents, and intellectuals are constantly mourning the abysmal state in Israel where kids have become reclusive computer game and TV addicts. This is the talk of the town. Your anecdotal evidence of Gan Saker falls far short of what analysts are saying: Israeli kids are playing less. The experiment of pro-sports has been amply tested in a country of 300 million and the results are in: "warped societal values of paying players millions while teachers get pennies." Give the fan-culture time and it will take root.

    2. Pinchas writes: The second ridiculous reason offered is that the players will get paid millions while the teachers get paid pennies. Once again I remind our readers we are talking about Israel and not America. Yossi Benayoun was Israelis highest paid player... I say was because, well, he wasn't making millions of dollars here and he wanted millions of dollars. To get it he had to leave Israel. Israel does that. She spits out just about anyone that wants only money. Israeli baseball players could never make anywhere near the money Major League players like A-Rod get simply because the teams would never be able to earn enough money. Today IBL players make a measly $1000 each - for the entire season.

    Yishai: "Who is a wise person - he who sees the future." Big trees start as small seeds. Pinchas' whole premise is that Israel is different. Is it? Only a few years ago there were no giant malls, no Home Center, no Ikea. Israel knows how to catch up fast. The trend is clear: Israel is following America, and kids worship its culture. Again, the experiment of pro-sports has borne its poisonous fruit. As I wrote in the previous post: "Pro-sports eventually leads to the warped societal values of paying players millions while teachers get pennies." The IBL is not "Field of Dreams" - it is a money-making enterprise. If it can make more money it will -just give it time. If we a bad thing forming we should nip it in the bud.

    3. Pinchas writes: Vayikra 18:3 - "Bechukoteyehem Lo Teleichu" is the third reason that baseball is evil. Yishai claims that when Rashi writes "their stadiums" and "their theaters" he means sports not just Roman-fighting. But there is no basis for that claim and no source was cited to support it. Indeed the Romans were not known to have any non-violent public sports at all. There may be some modern day poskim that posken this way (though I am not aware of any) however I do know that Kehillat Ohr Shalom in RBS has arranged a group trip to a Blue Sox game where the Rabbi, Rav Chaim Soloveitchik, shlita, has been invited to throw out the first ball. Seems at least he doesn't learn Rashi the way Yishai does.

    Yishai: I know many rabbis who are anti-Zionist - so what? -- they may know Rashi but they may miss the point nonetheless. As we know from the the holy Gaon from Vilna - the sitra achra attacks the rabbis. The fact is that Rashi does mention "stadiums" and we should always be on the look out for how problems of the past manifest themselves today. I looked at the original Gemara talking about stadiums in 18b and indeed Rashi seems to be talking about Roman bullfighting, but this is what I found on DafYomi.org with regard to the Gemara on Avoda Zara 18b:

    "RAV MOSHE FEINSTEIN (in IGROS MOSHE YD 4:11) was asked whether it is permitted to attend theaters and sporting events. He answered that "anyone who goes to these places transgresses the prohibitions of Moshav Letzim and Bitul Torah; not only does he transgress during the time spent in those places, but he also transgresses because these activities causes him to stop learning Torah entirely, as explained in the Gemara."

    "Apparently, Rav Moshe understands that the prohibition of participating in such activities is due to the severity of Moshav Letzim, and not merely because it constitutes a waste of time. He concludes that "there is another severe prohibition as he brings upon himself the Yetzer ha'Ra of promiscuity, as most of these things entail depraved speech and turning people towards promiscuity." This ruling is followed by today's Poskim as well (as heard from RAV TZVI WEBER, shlit'a, RAV SHMUEL KAMINETZKY, shlit'a, and RAV DAVID ZUCKER, shlit'a.)"


    4. Pinchas writes: Reason number four was an interesting one that was similar to number three. Namely that Baseball is not a "Jewish thing" because there are no rabbinic sources "lauding going to or watching professional sports." Well guess what? There are no rabbinic sources "lauding" listening to a radio show either! Or reading a web blog! Just because the gentiles do something doesn't inherently make it something evil. As for a rabbinic source see my response to number three. At least one Rabbi is bringing his congregation to a game.

    Yishai: Pinchas fails to answer the main question that I posed: is "the celebration of bodily ability" not the domain of the Greeks? Would the Maccabees, who gave their life to drive out the Hellenist so that they can sanctify the Land of Israel and Jerusalem, be sympathetic to the use of their "logo" for pro-sports? The IBL makes such a distortion palatable by slapping on the trappings of Judaism. As in the classic rabbinic parable: The pig also holds out his split hooves and claims that he is Kosher.

    With regard to weblogs and radio shows: if you're listening to my show or reading the Kumah weblog - you are learning Torah and being called to Jewish action. The rabbis approve of such actions voraciously. But in all of our great literature you cannot bring one source to legitimize watching pro-sports in stadiums.


    5. Pinchas writes: Yishai fifth was that 60% of the players are goyim. I say so what? Just because they are goyim they are evil? I for one don't subscribe to that notion. There are very many good goyim in the world and the Torah even allows for goyim under the right circumstances to live in Israel - which by the way - none of the non-Jewish players are doing. That said the IBL has declared on the record their intention to have majority of the players be native Israelis. That's one of the reasons for the baseball summer camps - to get Israeli youngsters playing baseball so Israelis can enjoy watching the local talent.

    Yishai: So now it's ok to bring goyyim to Israel to entertain Jews with their athletic prowess? Talk about "Bechukoteyehem Lo Teleichu"! We're importing non-Jews so that we can have our small kids look up to them.

    Don't count on the IBL turning all-Jewish either. If it does, that will be even a sadder day.

    With regards to "baseball summer camps" - that's a good thing - let children continue to play in fun athletic Jewish leagues all their lives (like the successful American Touch Football League.) But keep the pro-sports aspect far away from our kids - it will eventually distance them from Torah values.


    6. Pinchas writes: The sixth reason Yishai gave is imbecilic. No, really! Baseball is bittul Torah? By that logic so is listening to the radio and eating. Forget sleeping! Yes, Yishai you were right when you wrote "we all need relaxation and entertainment" and an outing at a baseball game is just that - relaxation and entertainment in a nice clean kosher family atmosphere. Many - actually most - of the games actually coincide with all Yeshiva Gedolah's bein hazmanim. Ask any Rosh Yeshiva. It is a mitzvah to take a break from a rigid Torah learning schedule to help one feel refreshed and learn better when the new zman commences. That's why every Yeshiva in the world has a bein hazmanim. I could think of a lot worse ways bochrim could spend their bein hazmanim.

    Yishai: As I wrote earlier, we all need a way to relax. The question is, however, whether the Orthodox world should be fully promoting it. Example: maybe I enjoy Spider Man movies; but have you ever seen it promoted on Kumah or Torah Tidbits? Have you ever seen it claimed that it's "100% kosher activity"? Of a vast course not. Though we are all human, that does not mean that we should actively promote those things that lead to Bittul Torah.

    7. Pinchas writes: I didn't quite understand the seventh and final reason that baseball in Israel is evil. It was that since sports could be followed on cable television and on the Internet, "why bring this thing to Israel?" This I don't get! Going out to a baseball game with the family is evil but bringing into the home the disgusting images that are featured on cable television, not to mention the Internet, are not a problem? Baseball is evil but the Internet is not? Sorry Yishai, but that is a very fat pitch!

    Yishai: The Talmud states : "Rav Ilai the Elder said: If a man sees that his evil urge is overwhelming him, let him go to a place where he is unknown, don black and cover himself with black, and do as his heart desires, but let him not publicly profane God's name" (Kiddushin 40a and Hagigah 16a).

    Adds Rabbi Dov Peretz Elkins: "It is clear to the Sages that many mortal persons will on (rare) occasions commit some act that is a departure from acceptable norms – some worse than others. If it has to be so, and let it be known that they did not condone this behavior, then let it not be seen or known by others. The act is unacceptable by itself, but would be far worse if done in a way that let others know, which would bring shame to the Jewish People, and thus to God. The statement we are studying is an ideal, and what Rav Ilai suggests is a failure to reach this ideal, but, he seems to be arguing, there are degrees in failure."

    My point is that if you need baseball, you don't need to make a league in Israel - you can go to "a place where he is unknown" - the internet - and "do as his heart desires, but let him not publicly profane God's name."


    Pinchas adds: We should be very thankful that the IBL has arrived in this young nation and we should give it our blessing and wish it much success. It will hopefully help the economy here and will make life in Israel more enjoyable for Israelis and for thousands of Olim that dreaded never again being able to ask Dad to take them out to the ballgame!

    Yishai: Every successive Aliyah brings with it good and bad things. The Yementites brought their tradition and their naivete, the Russian's brought their talent and their pork, the Sefardim brought their hospitality and their rudeness, the American's bring their work ethic and their pop-culture. We American Jews should be more focused on bringing the positive values of America that Israel does need - like representational democracy for example - instead of getting excited about something that our sensitive fledgling country does not need at all.

     
  • At 8:27 PM , Blogger BenSira said...

    The issue is not a question of Zionism; Yishai is not new to criticizing Jews in sports:

    http://commie.droryikra.com/v63i9/columns/pupil.shtml

     
  • At 9:01 PM , Blogger Ezra said...

    Yemenites are naive? That's the first I heard of it.

     
  • At 9:25 PM , Blogger Yishai said...

    Ezra - have you heard of the The Missing Yemenite Children? They stole their kids under noses. (Looks like your pop-fly was an easy out - maybe now you can add a more inyani comment to this discussion)

     
  • At 9:30 PM , Blogger Malkah said...

    Originally, I planned to post an article on the IBL which revolved around the 72 non-Jewish players specially imported to entertain the people of Israel as part of our favorite exile country's most nostalgic sport. As I didn't think it was fully thought out, I withdrew it.

    But the sentiment is still there, so I'll post anew.

    First, the psychology surrounding this issue just astounds me. I think a very decent PhD paper could be written just on these few posts, touching on issues such as religious zealotry (which I happen to consider a good thing), rationalization, fan culture, and other sundry psychosocial conditions.

    I know that Yishai has commented on all of Pinchas's points, but I'd love a swing.

    1. Yishai and Pinchas debate whether Israelis will become corpulent from watching sports. I'm not sure the issue is the actual increase of lard on the body of sports watchers (although I'm sure that can happen). I think the issue is more one of passivity. It's funny - here in Israel, we are fighting a REAL competition, where the scores actually mean something, and the bravery, commitment, leadership and followership of the teammates make a serious difference in the lives of real people. You'd think no one would have the energy for a fake competition, where guys in loose leotards chewing tabacco and vying for positions on bits of padding in an arena would be the laughing stock of the entire country. However, sports have allowed our people a bit of escapism. Now, I'm an advocate of getting your head out of our situation. I do it every day - heck, I cling to it. But I think that professional sports have enabled our brethren to transfer the aggression they should have toward their REAL enemies onto a bunch of mock mercenaries. Conversely, perhaps it partially turns our "limited skirmish in the Middle East" into only slightly more than a grizzly inning... and they're not even doing any of the running, swinging, or sliding themselves - they're watching other guys do it. Isn't that a tad lame?

    2. I looked up the salaries of Israeli soccer players online, and found a little something in an article from the June 5th Haaretz website - goalkeeper Pieter Merlier, who signed recently for Maccabi Herzliya, gets $120,000 a season - no, that's not extravagant according to American standards (where paying large amounts of money to entertainers is considered reasonable). However, considering that the average Israeli salary is $22,151.43 every year, I'd say this is a gross misdirection of resources. If baseball in Israel doesn't make money, it won't stick around. If it does, it'll be because it pays. Cash.

    3. The issue of going to the stadiums of the Romans is beyond the mere matter of violent sports in my mind (and it's true - baseball is probably less of an aveirah than watching boxing or even American football). It's an issue of "fandom".

    I'm against fan culture (asking someone for their signature for any reason other than to conduct some sort of business dealing is just pathetic, and ought to cause one to question where one's sense of self worth and dignity has gone). Of course, there have been people that I have really looked up to. But let's not forget what we're talking about here - an enterprise which pays money for people to be entertaining in a purely physical way. I could see people "idolizing" (ever notice how that pesky word "idol" shows up sometimes?) EVEN a comedian for being witty, a singer for being soothing or inspiring, but a baseball player is ultimately hitting a ball with a stick (or catching a ball), and that's basically it.

    4.Obviously, baseball doesn't have a Jewish background. This doesn't bother me, and I think it should be obvious that there's a difference between playing baseball and watching it. It DOES bother me that these people are only heroes because of the basically useless physical talents they display in exchange for pay and glory. Show me a guy with a useful physical ability (slingshotting, archery, jewelry-making, massage), and I promise to be impressed. I don't promise to buy all of his paraphrenalia, hang his name on my wall, and pay to cheer him on wherever he conducts his activities, but I'll definitely think he's a cool guy and a contribution to society.

    5. This issue of non-Jews playing in Israel is the single most enfuriating aspect of this league, and assures me that the goal of baseball in Israel is to be profitable, not to bring crackerjack-loving families some joy. If you had made me some teams from Jewish people, I might have even moved from ambivalent right on into quasi-proud. But 72 goyim from all over the world are being imported to Israel to play this game. We're their farm league, by the way - don't get excited. It's not like they've all lined up to reject their Mount Tabor-climbing demi-god and swear their allegiance to the Creator of Heaven and Earth. By the way, tell me they're not going to be mixing with Israel's prettiest models in 5 years time (it's already happened with Israel's non-Jewish basketball players). Tell me you'd let your daughters hang out with them. Tell me your son should want to be just like them. Tell me that ultimately, they AREN'T goyim from around the world whose sole interest in Israel or the Jews is that they're making them famous and giving him a good salary. Tell me G-d thinks professional baseball is neat.

    On a positive note, some of the 48 Jews will likely make aliyah (which is probably why the IBL feels confident enough to tell you that more Israelis will be playing soon).

    6. Watching the neighborhood kids play baseball isn't a waste of time. Painting something isn't a waste of time. Watching movies is a waste of time. Watching professional baseball is a waste of time. Don't kid yourself.

    7. Remember that thing I said about watching movies being a waste of time? Well, I do it, anyway. And I basically feel badly about it. But heck - at least I know it's wrong, and try to fight it. And I don't talk about how beautiful and value-laden it is, because it is neither beautiful, nor value-laden. It's vicarious and valueless. Just like professional baseball.

    Ultimately, I don't think this sport is going to single-handedly lead to the destruction of Israel. But I do think it's sad that another professional sport has set up shop here, ready to fill the heads of Israel's youngsters, and I think it's even sadder that the religious community isn't hardcore enough to see it for what it is. I won't be burning myself in effigy on the batter's mound, but I will suppress a frown when good little boys from religious families begin to chatter about the heroics of Adalberto Paulino, Hector De Los Santos, and Willis Bumphus. By the way, Abba, who was Yoni Netanyahu? Can't recall...

     
  • At 9:53 PM , Blogger Ezra said...

    I obviously know about yaldei Teiman - just think naiveté is stretch and not something that has stuck around or is very comparable to swine and baseball.

    Slandering the Yemenites is inyani. (He tags up...scores!)

     
  • At 3:12 AM , Blogger Pinchas said...

    Yishai, We can go back and forth point by point forever (and I do have comebacks). But like everything in life what it boils down to is moderation. If you say something is ALWAYS good or ALWAYS bad, then you should review sefer Koheles. Cleary being obsessive about baseball is problematic to the Torah Jews… but going to one or two games a season can certainly be a big mitzvah. My Yeshiva would take us every year to a NY Ranger game (imagine that - even with the violence - though they gave us musser after the game one year that we shouldn't have been cheering when the fights broke out!) But it was just a special treat - a good way to relax and clear our minds and then get back to work afterwards refreshed.

    Malkah, would you say watching Ushpizin is a waste of time? How about Schindler's list? See? Koheles is right.

    The challenge for the Jew is to take everything in life and use it properly - not to lock oneself in a room cutoff from the rest of society.

    Baseball in Israel is a great thing. Not because of the players, but because of the fans! Because I can sit in the stands with Jewish families sitting next to me, sitting in front of me, and sitting behind me, bonding. If you've never been to a game here, you wouldn't, you couldn't, possibly understand.

    Long live the IBL!

     

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